Chainsaw Man - Vol. 10 Ch. 84 - The Hero of Hell
- Thread starter MangaDex
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@Liquidxlax Even if it’s like that poses problem, if someone had under house arrest For no reason but to be controlling,...wouldn’t having no fear make you blindly accept that ? Or the whole people getting more obsessive about it....since no fear of being too controlling and no fear of being controlled....that dosen’t sound like living...
I mean not fearing hunger...wouldn’t that just make you starve to death because you don’t give it any consideration?
Fear is the consequences of not doing something right?
I think it doesn't matter which way it swings it seems like nothing Good will come from it...
Well it’s one those things where past plays a big part....if we started with this then got to this point I don’t think it would be as enjoyable? It’s like going full throttle then putting on the breaks
Still we don’t know how this changes since he fused with a human..if he just...eats his host would everyone just forget and it would mean nothing? It’s weird in itself the control demon can remember if others forget...
Besides since killing her will kill some random Japanese with an illness wouldn’t that mean if you destroy her everyone with Japanese heritage or under the Japanese government rule would all die of illness ....
I mean not fearing hunger...wouldn’t that just make you starve to death because you don’t give it any consideration?
Fear is the consequences of not doing something right?
I think it doesn't matter which way it swings it seems like nothing Good will come from it...
Well it’s one those things where past plays a big part....if we started with this then got to this point I don’t think it would be as enjoyable? It’s like going full throttle then putting on the breaks
Still we don’t know how this changes since he fused with a human..if he just...eats his host would everyone just forget and it would mean nothing? It’s weird in itself the control demon can remember if others forget...
Besides since killing her will kill some random Japanese with an illness wouldn’t that mean if you destroy her everyone with Japanese heritage or under the Japanese government rule would all die of illness ....
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@Turkeryjerkey oh fuck no fire punch was a piss poor manga I don't even know how some people think it's one of the best manga ever, although i do agree the first half is really good but after the city fight the quality drop from really good to shit really fucking fast, and don't fucking say it's abstract or some other bs
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@pakyu1199 Exactly! This manga was nice and had an interesting premise. Until the author just decided to speed-run the whole series and cram two arcs in 3 chapters.
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I do wonder how Chainsawman ended up as Poochi. Like what happened to make that a thing.
Thanks for the update!
Thanks for the update!
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Kobeni will actually be the final boss
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@Dranto
@KreamPunk
@MRain
If this author has one major flaw, I'd say it's setup. He's likes having interesting things happen, but doesn't put in the work to organically build up to them. That's why a lot of stuff feels rushed or like it just came out of left field and the pacing suffers. Not everything gets resolved, which is fine, real life isn't clean like that, but the lack of setup robs moments of their potential weight and can leave the reader feeling lost or disconnected. Important events aren't given time to breathe. At the same time though, this means it never gets bogged down like a lot of other series, and events can actually surprise you, but it's still a loss overall.
For me the value of his works stems from his willingness to stray from narrative tradition. I have read a lot of manga. Over time I've become less and less satisfied with more typical storytelling. It's like listening to a song you love over and over until you're sick of it. You know every beat by heart and it can't surpise or move you anymore. Lately I've started to rate originality and ambition more highly, even to the exclusion of more practical storytelling concerns. Standard stuff leaves me feeling bored or frustrated. Reading them feels like going through the motions, but I understand that a lot of people don't feel that way.
Of all the series on my reading list, I'd rate Fire Punch lowest, but it still stands out like a beacon of light against a sea of cookie-cutter isekais. Stories that don't follow predictable narrative beats really are few and far between these days. It's unfortunately not a masterpiece and it doesn't have universal appeal. How much you can enjoy it is going to depend on how much you're willing to overlook or how sick you are of the "normal."
@KreamPunk
@MRain
If this author has one major flaw, I'd say it's setup. He's likes having interesting things happen, but doesn't put in the work to organically build up to them. That's why a lot of stuff feels rushed or like it just came out of left field and the pacing suffers. Not everything gets resolved, which is fine, real life isn't clean like that, but the lack of setup robs moments of their potential weight and can leave the reader feeling lost or disconnected. Important events aren't given time to breathe. At the same time though, this means it never gets bogged down like a lot of other series, and events can actually surprise you, but it's still a loss overall.
For me the value of his works stems from his willingness to stray from narrative tradition. I have read a lot of manga. Over time I've become less and less satisfied with more typical storytelling. It's like listening to a song you love over and over until you're sick of it. You know every beat by heart and it can't surpise or move you anymore. Lately I've started to rate originality and ambition more highly, even to the exclusion of more practical storytelling concerns. Standard stuff leaves me feeling bored or frustrated. Reading them feels like going through the motions, but I understand that a lot of people don't feel that way.
Of all the series on my reading list, I'd rate Fire Punch lowest, but it still stands out like a beacon of light against a sea of cookie-cutter isekais. Stories that don't follow predictable narrative beats really are few and far between these days. It's unfortunately not a masterpiece and it doesn't have universal appeal. How much you can enjoy it is going to depend on how much you're willing to overlook or how sick you are of the "normal."
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@Turkeyjerkey I don't know how it was a breath of a fresh air for you, I mean I guess for an old manga it was rare to have an immortal character? The only thing that I felt when I was reading the story was the author is confused how can he ended/continue the series evidence by the "GOD" arc.
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@MRain
It was a breath of fresh air because it didn't have a standard story that followed the same narrative beats I've seen a million times. Most authors are risk averse. Consciously or not, they end up following tried and true character and narrative arcs that have been done many times before. When I read them, I'm not surprised by anything that happens. I can see things coming a mile away and the story loses its impact. In a vacuum such works would be fine, but to me they may as well not even exist.
It's like how call of duty 4 was a great game, but after just repackaging it every year and selling it as a new game it became shit. Same problem with isekai and other ln adaptations. So many are just repackaging what's already been done without putting in any thought or creativity. Read one, you've read 'em all. So many of them don't even have themes to explore, they're just empty, juvenile wish-fulfillment.
Fire Punch was unpredictable. Just when you thought you knew where it was going it would suddenly derail in a completely new direction. If you handed its premise to the average author they'd probably write a standard shounen battle manga where the mc goes on a quest, beats successively stronger opponents and trains until he is able to defeat the man who destroyed his village and save the world from the ice witch. But it doesn't.
It didn't just set out to recycle what's already popular into more bland, inoffensive garbage with no ambition beyond juvenile wish-fulfillment, like so much of what comes out today. I could be mistaken, but the fact that you thought my interest hinged on it having an immortal character tells me you are still reading stories on a surface level.
It was a breath of fresh air because it didn't have a standard story that followed the same narrative beats I've seen a million times. Most authors are risk averse. Consciously or not, they end up following tried and true character and narrative arcs that have been done many times before. When I read them, I'm not surprised by anything that happens. I can see things coming a mile away and the story loses its impact. In a vacuum such works would be fine, but to me they may as well not even exist.
It's like how call of duty 4 was a great game, but after just repackaging it every year and selling it as a new game it became shit. Same problem with isekai and other ln adaptations. So many are just repackaging what's already been done without putting in any thought or creativity. Read one, you've read 'em all. So many of them don't even have themes to explore, they're just empty, juvenile wish-fulfillment.
Fire Punch was unpredictable. Just when you thought you knew where it was going it would suddenly derail in a completely new direction. If you handed its premise to the average author they'd probably write a standard shounen battle manga where the mc goes on a quest, beats successively stronger opponents and trains until he is able to defeat the man who destroyed his village and save the world from the ice witch. But it doesn't.
It starts out as a standard revenge story, but then stops in its tracks and examines its own premise of revenge both from a moral and narrative standpoint. The mc is forced to confront the reality of his feelings. The phoniness of his supposed goal is highlighted his quest being filmed and scripted as a movie. The reader to forced to confront their own desire for violence and catharsis and the roles that fictional narratives play in our lives. The fact the ideology and mythology of the authoritarian city is based on an old action movie is commentary on the way narratives, both cultural and religious have shaped and controlled our own societies. How they're used to justify the actions of those in power and control the populace.
Watching him attempt to recreate his sister using the mind wiped remains of the person responsible for her death, all the while wrestling with how absurd the lie he's living has become was way more interesting to me than any action scene. Through him we see how people lie to and delude themselves to make living bearable, but also that the underlying tension of those lies can bubble to the surface and destroy them.
By the end they didn't even show many of the fights that happened because the context for the fights was what mattered. Seeing him cut off his own face to strip away his humanity and give into violence was more important than the fight itself.
It wrestled with concepts of morality, justice, responsibility, the function and purpose of stories and the lies people tell themselves to get by. It had actual narrative ambition, and wasn't afraid to alienate its audience. I'm willing to bet a lot of people jumped ship after it became clear it wasn't just a revenge story. Making the choice to bait the audience like they before pulling the rug out from under them takes balls for an author, and I respect that. Not only is it ballsy, but it serves a narrative function. It gets the audience hyped to experience his violent revenge before yanking on the choke chain and forcing us to examine our own bloodlust and how we are susceptible to fiction.
Watching him attempt to recreate his sister using the mind wiped remains of the person responsible for her death, all the while wrestling with how absurd the lie he's living has become was way more interesting to me than any action scene. Through him we see how people lie to and delude themselves to make living bearable, but also that the underlying tension of those lies can bubble to the surface and destroy them.
By the end they didn't even show many of the fights that happened because the context for the fights was what mattered. Seeing him cut off his own face to strip away his humanity and give into violence was more important than the fight itself.
It wrestled with concepts of morality, justice, responsibility, the function and purpose of stories and the lies people tell themselves to get by. It had actual narrative ambition, and wasn't afraid to alienate its audience. I'm willing to bet a lot of people jumped ship after it became clear it wasn't just a revenge story. Making the choice to bait the audience like they before pulling the rug out from under them takes balls for an author, and I respect that. Not only is it ballsy, but it serves a narrative function. It gets the audience hyped to experience his violent revenge before yanking on the choke chain and forcing us to examine our own bloodlust and how we are susceptible to fiction.
It didn't just set out to recycle what's already popular into more bland, inoffensive garbage with no ambition beyond juvenile wish-fulfillment, like so much of what comes out today. I could be mistaken, but the fact that you thought my interest hinged on it having an immortal character tells me you are still reading stories on a surface level.
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@Turkeyjerkey Fair enough the moral side of thing was kinda a fresh air to just punching and revenge story, but i really still doesn't like it how the character got treated like they are not even a character and just a cardboard that can be disposed if needed too (even Togata T ^T poor boy) although maybe it was just me because I really can't connect with Agni (maybe it was because his face who know).
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It's rather weird how Makima keeps referring to Chainsaw Man as Chainsaw Man, and not Chainsaw Devil.
The author is definitely hinting something here.
Perhaps Chainsaw Man is actually some sort of Human Devil (going by the "muh humans are the real monsters" trope)
Humans give birth to concepts, so it would be fitting for the Human Devil to have the power to erase concepts.
Now it forms an Ouroboros.
Human creates concepts, and the fear of certain concepts create devils.
Somehow a Human Devil was created, and has the power to erase concepts.
Since this is Fujimoto Tatsuki, I'm not surprised if the story ends up in Chainsaw Man ending humans as a concept, or the entire concept of existence for that matter.
The author is definitely hinting something here.
Perhaps Chainsaw Man is actually some sort of Human Devil (going by the "muh humans are the real monsters" trope)
Humans give birth to concepts, so it would be fitting for the Human Devil to have the power to erase concepts.
Now it forms an Ouroboros.
Human creates concepts, and the fear of certain concepts create devils.
Somehow a Human Devil was created, and has the power to erase concepts.
Since this is Fujimoto Tatsuki, I'm not surprised if the story ends up in Chainsaw Man ending humans as a concept, or the entire concept of existence for that matter.
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i seriously don't get this whole plot thingy.
someone pls give me a short version
someone pls give me a short version
